Poliigon Texture bank (related to KS)

[zooropa]

I just subscribed to Poliigon. I watched their tutorials related to KS.
Apparently in KS there needs to be added a "color invert" node to get the right material (Specular and Roughness).

I believe I am getting exactly the opposite results following the Poliigon explanation.



It might be that something changed from the version they are using and KS 7 ? If so I believe KS and Poliigon should update each other in order to clarify the workflow nowadays.

Thanks a lot.

[mattjgerard]

I made an empty material template specifically for poliigon stuff. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I still find myself twiddling dials and pushing buttons until I get something that works, but I always feel like I'm just groping around not knowing what controls what. My setup is exactly like your inverted one, and I still struggle getting good results.

Might be because of my lighting too, not sure.

[zooropa]

Apparently they behave differently...you are correct. Now I downloaded other textures and they do need to invert ..

I will send an email to poliigon...i think it is extremely time consuming to do different " maths " for using the textures.

[mattjgerard]

They do have the tutorials, but for some reason they don't really explain what settings to what and why. I am hoping to go to RenderWorld this year and corner someone and hold them hostage until they can explain it to me!  Would like to get an answer sooner than that, but hey.....

Also, its one thing to make an orb look tiled, but quite different to get surface imperfections hacks and paint scratches on the right spot on the ass end of a forklift and make them look realistic. I've seen others do it, but for the life of me I just can't figure it out.

[zooropa]

The tutorials i saw it. The problem is what they explain is the opposite as the outcome I am getting..

I do not need to invert my maps in some cases.

[NM-92]

Apparently, Poliigon delivers glossiness textures instead of roughness. There's a checkbox on the advanced tab inside settings that let you choose wheter to use Glossy or Roughness in Keyshot. Try enabling that and see what you come up to. I think this automatically inverts how black/whites behave regarding the roughness of a material.

[Will Gibbons]

Since Poliigon launched they've grown their library and offerings significantly. I assume they'll continue to change or improve their textures over time. That means some older assets may differ from their newer ones. I don't know this for sure, but I suspect it may be.

I have been in contact with somebody there and the lines of communication are open. We'd like to produce some content showing how to use their assets but I think your best bet is to always use their maps as a starting point and then create your material.

I recommend using your eye to be the judge of what looks right and not and to familiarize yourself with what a specular map should look like so you can make adjustments to dial it in. Same goes for each map really. This isn't me saying "You should know how to do this", rather it's me suggesting that some research and a few hours of experimentation will save you from having to try to memorize a formula which may or may not always be the solution.

Hopefully this shines some light on the subject, though it's not necessarily the solution you were looking for.

[INNEO_MWo]

Apparently, Poliigon delivers glossiness textures instead of roughness. There's a checkbox on the advanced tab inside settings that let you choose wheter to use Glossy or Roughness in Keyshot. Try enabling that and see what you come up to. I think this automatically inverts how black/whites behave regarding the roughness of a material.

What Nico wrote sounds quite interesting. Have to give it a try.

Thanks!

[mattjgerard]

This is all great information, and Yeah Will, you are right, taking some time to figure those things out will be key, I'm just not sure where to start. Some training content would be most welcome, and some hints as to the inner workings of how specular and bump channels are read and interpreted in KS so I know what to adjust to get the look I'm looking for. I do see the value in working through it and figuring it out myself, I do tend to remember that which I figure out better. Just need a little nudge in the right direction.

Maybe a topic for Render World? ?!? Might actually make it this year

[Will Gibbons]

This is all great information, and Yeah Will, you are right, taking some time to figure those things out will be key, I'm just not sure where to start. Some training content would be most welcome, and some hints as to the inner workings of how specular and bump channels are read and interpreted in KS so I know what to adjust to get the look I'm looking for. I do see the value in working through it and figuring it out myself, I do tend to remember that which I figure out better. Just need a little nudge in the right direction.

Maybe a topic for Render World? ?!? Might actually make it this year

I hope to see you there. I just drafted up our workshop topics. I'm planning on doing a Mat Graph one which will certainly hit on this.

[NM-92]

I generally start all my materials tuning the roughness/glossy map. Some people use color to number node to dial this. Personally i've never learned to use it, so i just load the texture, map it right, and then just play with brightness/contrast to set the intensity of the roughness effect. Once you've done this, you can start to add bumps and more stuff, like layered materials on top of that. I barely use the specular channel, cause i think the roughness one is enough.

I've uploaded an example of a rough metal i've created in the past. If you notice on the Mat Graph, the brightness on the roughness texture is set extremely low, and the contrast pretty high. These is usually what i do with pretty much all the smudges/worn textures from Poliigon to make the effect noticeable. Again, this can also be tuned with a color to number node, so the choice is personal. Hope this helps to get it right !

[zooropa]

I managed to get in contact to Poliigon customer service.

This is the answer:

"Thanks for getting in contact with us and you are correct about that particular material and since it is considered a metal, it works with either specular and metalness workflows which require a slightly different setup. For Keyshot only the specular workflow will work which I assume you are using. Now when using a metal material like this the settings are mostly the same as the video, except you do not invert the REFL map because that is where the color information is stored. Also for metal materials make sure to disable the "Fresnel" feature to make them look correct. Here is a node setup with the proper settings for specular workflow metal: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ngf8tq4vj6to68/Keyshot%20Metal%20Setup.jpg?dl=0
"

Hope it adds something. I did not get totally certain of when to use what. I think they need to expand in better detail the workflow between poliigon and Ks.

Regards

[mattjgerard]

I managed to get in contact to Poliigon customer service.

This is the answer:

"Thanks for getting in contact with us and you are correct about that particular material and since it is considered a metal, it works with either specular and metalness workflows which require a slightly different setup. For Keyshot only the specular workflow will work which I assume you are using. Now when using a metal material like this the settings are mostly the same as the video, except you do not invert the REFL map because that is where the color information is stored. Also for metal materials make sure to disable the "Fresnel" feature to make them look correct. Here is a node setup with the proper settings for specular workflow metal: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ngf8tq4vj6to68/Keyshot%20Metal%20Setup.jpg?dl=0
"

Hope it adds something. I did not get totally certain of when to use what. I think they need to expand in better detail the workflow between poliigon and Ks.

Regards

If they really wanted to be pals, they would upload a couple of empty Materials to the KS cloud for different situations? Poliigon templates? I've made mine, but the more I dig into their library, not all materials can be reassembled in KS the same way.

[mattjgerard]

This is all great information, and Yeah Will, you are right, taking some time to figure those things out will be key, I'm just not sure where to start. Some training content would be most welcome, and some hints as to the inner workings of how specular and bump channels are read and interpreted in KS so I know what to adjust to get the look I'm looking for. I do see the value in working through it and figuring it out myself, I do tend to remember that which I figure out better. Just need a little nudge in the right direction.

Maybe a topic for Render World? ?!? Might actually make it this year

I hope to see you there. I just drafted up our workshop topics. I'm planning on doing a Mat Graph one which will certainly hit on this.

Ahh, right on! My coworker got to go last year, me being new at the job then. Might be my turn this year, we will see what the bossman says.

[Will Gibbons]

Ahh, right on! My coworker got to go last year, me being new at the job then. Might be my turn this year, we will see what the bossman says.

Make it happen!